When was the Veil implemented?

Hello all, I am kind of confused with the time, if that can be a valid term here, when the veil was implemented. I understand that this was in the “prior octave”, and I’m inclined to believe that when they refer to this previous octave, they are referring to the previous “heartbeat” of the Creation. Meaning that shortly after what we call “the Big Bang”, this veil was conceived and placed, as Ra explains in 78.10.

I’ve heard some people say that the veil was established in this octave of our Logos (Sun), and even that a portion of our third density experience was unveiled. All this makes no sense to my understanding of the chronology, again this being a poor word for the perception of evolution, of events and changes performed by the various logoi. Furthermore, if I understand this correctly, Ra’s time in Venus was over 2.6 billon years ago, and they had a veil.

What are your thoughts on this? And is there any information I’m forgetting in the Ra Material or perhaps conscious channeling that explains the possible “time” of veil implementation?

Thank you in advance =)

The veilling was invented during our current Octave. It is my understanding that each Octave begins in a big bang and ends in a big crunch (thus the heartbeat). The first civilisations closer to the center of the galaxy were not veiled. Incidentally, what I find very interesting is that the consequences of the veilling (the possibility of service-to-self) was never imagined by any Logoi until it was experienced. What we experience was not planned at the beginning of this octave.

Some quotes about the Veil to add to @Patrick post:

Law of One 82.12
Questioner: I was interested in specifically how this very first division showed up in this octave. I was interested to know if it made the transition through first, second, third, fourth, fifth, etc., densities?

I would like to take the first mind/body/spirit complexes and trace their experience from the very start to the present so that I would better understand the condition that we are in now by comparing it with this original growth. Could you please tell me precisely how this came about as to the formation, possibly, of the planets and the growth through the densities, if that is the way it happened, please?

Ra: I am Ra. Your queries seem more confused than your basic mental distortions in this area. Let us speak in general, and perhaps you may find a less confused and more simple method of eliciting information in this area.

A very great deal of creation was manifested without the use of the concepts involved in consciousness, as you know it. The creation itself is a form of consciousness which is unified—the Logos being the one great heart of creation.

The process of evolution through this period, which may be seen to be timeless, is most valuable to take into consideration, for it is against the background of this essential unity of the fabric of creation that we find the ultimate development of the Logoi which chose to use that portion of the harvested consciousness of the Creator to move forward with the process of knowledge of self.

As it had been found to be efficient to use the various densities, which are fixed in each octave, in order to create conditions in which self-conscious sub-Logoi could exist, this was carried out throughout the growing flower-strewn field, as your simile suggests, of the One Infinite Creation.

The first beings of mind, body, and spirit were not complex. The experience of mind/body/spirits at the beginning of this octave of experience was singular. There was no third-density forgetting. There was no veil. The lessons of third density are predestined by the very nature of the vibratory rates experienced during this particular density, and by the nature of the quantum jump to the vibratory experiences of fourth density.

Q’uo - May 12, 2018
Thank you for the opportunity, Q’uo. We do have a couple of questions from our friend, Fox, who asks: In the book Carla channeled, called A Book of Days, it states that “the dealings of the two polarities are separate, negative polarity being the choice to separate from positive unity.” Her question asks: “Before the veil there was only service to others, or positive unity. Is it an actual choice in third density to remain in positive unity, or is the only real choice that of separating from positive polarity and moving to negative polarity?

I am Q’uo, and am aware of your query, my brother. Within this illusion that you now experience that has been created as it is because of the existence of what you call “the veil of forgetting”, there is, indeed a choice that can be made, and must needs be made, if entities are to be, shall we say, graduated into the fourth density of love and understanding. This choice, as you are aware, is that which is to be either of service to others or service to self. Now, upon the surface of it, it would seem that there are, indeed, two distinct choices in this condition that has resulted because of the presence and the implementation of the veil of forgetting by those Logoi who have been, shall we say, able to prosper or benefit from the earlier Logoi who had no such veil and had some difficulty within the third-density illusion of shepherding the flock through the third density because of a seeming lack of choice.

In reality, in the larger sense, shall we say, when one looks at the outcome of each choice—that of service to others and service to self—as each grouping of entities continues to proceed along the evolutionary path, there is a distinct difference between each choice. Separation is the polar opposite of communion and coming into unity, and yet each [polarity] deals with the desire to become, once again, the One Infinite Creator. The means by which this desire is fulfilled seems to be quite opposite and different for the negative polarity in that it intends, and does indeed, separate itself from all other selves, and compacts itself to the degree that it seems totally removed from all around it. And yet, one must remember that there is nothing in motion that has not been made, and which does not contain, the One Creator. The Creator has made all that is, and has provided free will in the ultimate sense for each portion of its own being—both those portions which seek to radiate the love and light of the One Creator, and those which seek to absorb the love and light of the One Creator—and yet both deal with the love and the light of the One Creator for the purpose of moving back into unity with the One Creator.

In this regard, it would seem that the basic elements of each path are the same. It is the means by which the desire of each polarity is manifested that makes the paths appear different. But, we must remember, my friends that much of what is an appearance in any aspect or polarity, is an illusion that exists for the purpose of aiding each path to progress to its final destination. All the creation is an illusion, or a distortion, of the One Creator to assist portions of the One Creator to travel through the One Creator in order to return to the One Creator. All of the action, the thought, and the being within the one infinite creation is a means by which the Creator learns more of itself from itself.

[In] the situation that existed before the veil of forgetting it seemed that there was not so much free will available to third-density entities, yet these entities in themselves were each capable and free to make choices regarding each aspect of their spiritual journey. However, it could be said that because there was no veil, there was no opportunity to proceed as quickly as was later possible after the implementation of the veil of forgetting, for when it is not easily apparent to a third-density entity that it is the One Creator, that all of the facets of unity of love and of light that belong to the One Creator and each of its portions are not obvious, then it is that the entity in third density must work in the conscious sense to exercise its own will and faith that such possibilities are true and can be realized by each entity. This is an arduous process, my friends, taking many, as you know, incarnations in order to accomplish this polarization in consciousness, which is actually the action of each third-density entity after the veil of forgetting was implemented.

All of the trial and error, the spiritual sweat, shall we say, that has been spent attempting to make a coherent sense out of the life pattern, is the basics of the polarization process. This is where progress, ironically enough, and paradoxically enough, is most rapid, when the truth is hidden from the third-density being, then the attempt must be made to attempt to find the truth, and whether this takes a moment or a lifetime or a series of lifetimes, still the progress is far quicker with the veil in place than without it, for without the veil what is the motivation to change the conditions that are observed to be of unity where each is the Creator? There is no fear or love so great as to motivate a change in attitude or position.

Therefore, we would say that it is a matter of perspective that one may see from a distance, shall we say, that reveals that in truth the only choice for all entities, before or after the veil, is to return to the One Creator, to have many, many experiences on this journey home. The question then becomes, shall some means be implemented that accelerates this journey? For all eventually learn, some more quickly than others.

Yes I have been wondering about that question. :slight_smile: I guess we could care a bit less about speedy progress per se and so skip all the suffering that comes with the veiling’s consequences? I wonder if the Universe is debating that sort of thing.


Thanks @Patrick I was missing that piece of information actually, that our galaxy did have unveiled third density experiences, but it was later that the veil was conceived.

Also! @anon11466748 your reference on Q’uo is very synchronistic, my podcast episode of yesterday was exactly on this channeling. And I have to say that the question didn’t come from that channeling, but from people saying what I mentioned in my post. I had a hintergedanken that the veil was fully in place in our sub-logos experience, but I wasn’t clear how “long ago” was it.

Thanks for the answers! Can’t believe still the synchronicity that you referenced, out of all the many channelings, the same Q’uo channeling I posted yesterday in my channels. Love it =)

Oh, and I made a point in my podcast in this particular part, which can be taken at the human level, so to speak, to the whole Confederation and Logoic system, is it really necessary that we speed up processes which are inevitable? I suppose love comes into play here.

This has been happening to me a lot lately. I feel very in sync with the cosmic energy these days, and I gravitate towards exactly what I need. I never know that is what I need, I just go, “this feels correct,” and go with that feeling.

I’m glad it brought such synchronicity to you. :wink:

Or not make the veil as thick as it is.

I’ve gotten used to synchronicities (compared to my initial euphoric stages when I first started happening), but sometimes they are so beautiful on how they stand out, it’s a kind of art between reality and the (veiled) mind.

I felt like sharing this to this thread:

Law of One 83.16
Questioner: What techniques and methods of penetration of the veil were planned, and are there any others that have occurred other than those planned?

Ra: I am Ra. There were none planned by the first great experiment. As all experiments, this rested upon the nakedness of hypothesis. The outcome was unknown.

It was discovered, experientially and empirically, that there were as many ways to penetrate the veil as the imagination of mind/body/spirit complexes could provide. The desire of mind/body/spirit complexes to know that which was unknown drew to them the dreaming and the gradual opening to the seeker of all of the balancing mechanisms leading to adepthood and communication with teach/learners which could pierce this veil.

The various unmanifested activities of the self were found to be productive, in some degree, of penetration of the veil. In general we may say that by far the most vivid and even extravagant opportunities for the piercing of the veil are a result of the interaction of polarized entities.

I have experienced this with my interactions with my partner, as well as those from the forums and my own personal soul group connections. I feel the more we connect, the easier it is to see beyond the veil by merging our energies together to create a powerful force to see beyond it. We must find creative ways to pierce it, to remember the Oneness of all of creation.

Thank you once again, this is very valuable to me. I recently read this and thought about this power we have together in our soul groups:

Q’uo October 6th 2021
It is that time now within your incarnation and within the planet’s clock face, shall we say, that the hour has come, and has been for some time now, to be able to manifest the product of your thinking, your thoughts and images that are of a spiritual nature and are able to enhance your evolutionary process. This is a grand event for all as you are beginning to form that grouping of intelligence and spiritual essence that will allow you to join together as a social memory complex where the experience of any is shared by all.

By ‘veil’ here I refer to the veil of forgetting of each physical incarnation.
As there are multiple layers of ‘veil’, including the ‘veil of forgetting’ that you are actually the one infinite creator, you are actually everyone and everything.

Imagine if you remember that in your past life you are a Japanese woman, living in Nagasaki around the year 1945, you and all of your family member, children, husband. mom, dad died in a sudden gigantic blast. You will be born with a gigantic trauma, alas, you’re now born in the USA and your dad is in the military.

As such the ‘veil of forgetting of each physical incarnation’ actually enable an entity to forget all of the trauma in the past and have a ‘fresh new start’ and actually help to alleviate suffering.

Having said that, the veil itself is ‘penetrable’.
There’s a way where you can collect ‘memory from other identities’.
Yes any other identities including the identities that’s sharing the same timeline as you.
As identities are merely virtual and it’s the veil that actually create those virtual identities to become ‘somewhat realistic’, I am only this physical body and not other physical body.

The penetration will happen in stages, the ultimate ‘penetration’ will be penetrating the veil that makes you forget that you are actually everyone and everything.

And once you did that, you will know about ‘when’ was the veil implemented and also a wonderful twist that there are multiple timelines thus making the question of ‘when’ (or where) deemed somewhat irrelevant.

How to penetrate the forgetting process:

I wanted to share this from “Secrets of the UFO,” because I always thought it was haunting and it stayed with me ever since I first read it several months ago.

As a reference to those who haven’t read this, it’s from a hypnotic regression Carla had once, where she remembered coming here to help and remembers the veil coming down on her.

The blind closes.

When I come back here, the slate is wiped clean. It’s hard to see.
(Pause) There is much sadness here.

This planet …

I just see it.

It will be forgotten. We will forget.

It’s gone. (whispering) It’s gone.

THE MEMORY OF THE PAST ON THAT PLANET IS GONE? Off, off—it’s gone. There is white slate. It’s new—forgotten.

Can we pierce the veil alone?
That link says you should be with someone of like mind, but I have nobody.

Even interacting on the boards helps greatly. It has helped me in ways I couldn’t even imagine. I find that starting topics that feel close to your heart helps. I read them over and over again until I can see the connections within my own life. There are other ways to pierce it, through dreams and meditations, as mentioned in the following channeling:

Q’uo - January 16, 2005
S: I’ve had a question that I’ve been thinking about for some time. If I wanted to recover all the knowledge and wisdom of all the lifetimes that I had, how would I do that?

Q’uo: We are those of Q’uo, and are aware of your query, my brother. You are asking this query within third-density incarnation and our shortest answer would be to say that you would be able to recover that information immediately following your crossing of the gateway of death. Once through that gateway, reunited with full consciousness and full communication with your higher self, you would have the unimpaired memory of all that you have been and, indeed, all that you would be in the future. Within third density, it is not considered a helpful thing to have that full range of information available. It is considered, as you know, much more helpful for a discreet curtain to be drawn over all previous experiences so that you may hit the particular incarnation in which you are involved running, and give it the serious consideration that it deserves, all on its own.

The ways of penetrating the veil of forgetting are limited within incarnation. There is the dreaming process and those who work with dreams are often able to recover memory of past lives as they gradually find themselves in dream landscapes which constitute a different environment that begins to have a reality of its own.

The most common way that entities are able to recover past life information is the contacting of the deep mind by the conscious mind which is done in sessions of regressive hypnosis in which, with the help of a hypnotist, the self is taken back before birth to previous lives and questions are asked which enable the person to recover some of those memories.

The ways to penetrate the veil are many. You have to find what works best for you, which is just further inspiration to know your true nature. :wink:

Some more veil quotes I feel are helpful:

Law of One - 83.17
Questioner: Could you expand on what you mean by that interaction of polarized entities in piercing the veil?

Ra: I am Ra. We shall state two items of note.

The first is the extreme potential for polarization in the relationship of two polarized entities which have embarked upon the service-to-others path or, in some few cases, the service-to-self path.

Secondly, we would note that effect which we have learned to call the doubling effect. Those of like mind which together seek shall far more surely find.

Law of One - 83.18
Questioner: Specifically, by what process in the first case, when two polarized entities would attempt to penetrate the veil, whether they be positively or negatively polarized—specifically by what technique would they penetrate the veil?

Ra: I am Ra. The penetration of the veil may be seen to begin to have its roots in the gestation of green-ray activity, that all-compassionate love which demands no return. If this path is followed the higher energy centers shall be activated and crystallized until the adept is born. Within the adept is the potential for dismantling the veil to a greater or lesser extent that all may be seen again as one. The other-self is primary catalyst in this particular path to the piercing of the veil, if you would call it that.

Yes there are many ‘ways’ to ‘penetrate the veil’.
‘the veil’ is basically a ‘data / memory isolation mechanism’ if it’s in the computer.
Without ‘the veil’ the sense of ‘separation’ cannot be achieved.

The key is to access the ‘subconscious state’, hypnosis/past life regression session is a way to achieve that, meditation is another way, dream (and recall the memory from it) another way or even by ‘being in the now’.

Besides ‘identities not in your current timeline’ (refer as “past lives”), it also works to ‘other identities sharing your timeline’, sometimes referred as ‘telepathy’, and it’s not only with human but non-human as well. (Plants / Animals) or alien/deities (such as in the case of Ra/Quo channeling)

Anna Breytenbach, an animal communicator, is among the example.

How to Communicate with Plants and Trees

As Ra mentioned, dismantling the veil will uncover that all is actually one.

I’ve recently come to understand that the veil is the forgetting we experience… the dullness. The veil is the distraction from our journey of self awareness and thus our awareness to our connection with all, our knowing, seeing one self in another self.
I think the veil is the illusion of belief in forgetting. That it is possible to forget, as the belief in forgetting who we are is the veil and it becomes thinner or lifts as more beings step into a place of seeking and awareness of self. It’s simple as … exfoliating … no like, some s word, off dead skin… it’s protected one but the need for this is no longer… like a cast kind of or a sunburn. We can not truly forget who we are and we can not unsee what we see, unknow what is known … it’s becoming aware of all that is and all that we have lived as if we had forgotten… the more that do this… the … faster this occurs… vibrational patterns at play but also the more light … the more light illuminates the unseeing… it’s a momentum thing in this way.

It’s laid upon us when ? It’s , for me, of value to notice it exists for the lifting to be. The more that are awareness of their Light from within, the more beacons shine for others to find their ways in the dark. In this more of the illusion of forgetting is lifted, more Light fills, illuminates. Each that sees their Light, with in and with out, has aided in lifting the vail of forgetting. To turn your awareness or attention to how such a thing is… it to … keep the vail upon us for so many questions that seem to be enlightening are truly distractions from Light and knowing, from memory and the awareness and connection within.

I haven’t noticed the veil thinning at all.